Less opacity in the reporting process

@Erisian said in #10:
> Nice. A youtube link that doesn't work. You sure showed me, champ. And whatever they said, I'm sure it's totally smart. What can be smarter for a chess site than "let the cheaters stay and just hope nobody notices they are in a tiny pool of other cheaters". That's so smart and brilliant. Not like all those other sites and their silly "banning the cheating accounts and getting rid of them".
>
> Who in their right minds made a decision this patently absurd? Did some reddit mod get ahold of the site and thinks shadowbanning just works everywhere?

It worked for me. He said something like this with a French accent, "So you see, deese cheaters are shadowbanned. Deese cheaters don't know dey ahh shadowbanned. Dey can type, but no one sees. Except for da other cheaters."

Well, that means he is assuming the cheaters aren't waiting for a reply. When you don't get a reply, what can you do? MAKE A NEW ACCOUNT!!

@TheyAreScaryMoves said in #11:
>
That's embarrassing. But I'm not surprised it'd be some European putting this dumb idea into place. Really explains a lot. That's just tragically inept and incompetent. Nobody will ever figure that one out. That's why shadowbanning is so effective and nobody ever figures it out and just evades it because it's really obvious now that it's a known thing.

@Erisian said in #12:
> That's embarrassing. But I'm not surprised it'd be some European putting this dumb idea into place. Really explains a lot. That's just tragically inept and incompetent. Nobody will ever figure that one out. That's why shadowbanning is so effective and nobody ever figures it out and just evades it because it's really obvious now that it's a known thing.

The irony is it started out with him stating he started Lichess after making an online chessboard and putting it on a server. Then he saw someone actually playing it. "What is deez?"

So, just like the cheater, he wasn't expecting interaction.

@for_cryingout_loud said in #3:
> Now why cant there be more transparency is simple

I would like to persuade you that transparency in that matter could be simply better. As said before in another thread, a simple reply like "insufficient arguments" to deny a report is clean and requires no further explanation.

As well as giving tools for users to be informed on the evolution of the blocking list seems more pedagogical than providing no information at all...

@kinsana said in #14:
>"I would like to persuade you that transparency in that matter could be simply better. As said before in another thread, a simple reply like "insufficient arguments" to deny a report is clean and requires no further explanation.
"

And then the witch hunts start or people instead of complaining about transparency will say that lichess mods are dumb
and x is a cheater because all reporters believe they are right

@Erisian said in #10:
> Nice. A youtube link that doesn't work. You sure showed me, champ. And whatever they said, I'm sure it's totally smart. What can be smarter for a chess site than "let the cheaters stay and just hope nobody notices they are in a tiny pool of other cheaters". That's so smart and brilliant. Not like all those other sites and their silly "banning the cheating accounts and getting rid of them".
>
> Who in their right minds made a decision this patently absurd? Did some reddit mod get ahold of the site and thinks shadowbanning just works everywhere?

search "Lichess founder Thibault Duplessis lectures on Lichess (2017)"
On youtube then

@TheyAreScaryMoves @Erisian

well if you believe you can do better you can always make your own website and try or you can try and fail fighting the idea of the guy who has been running lichess for 10+ years

@TheyAreScaryMoves said in #11:
> It worked for me. He said something like this with a French accent, "So you see, deese cheaters are shadowbanned. Deese cheaters don't know dey ahh shadowbanned. Dey can type, but no one sees. Except for da other cheaters."
>
> Well, that means he is assuming the cheaters aren't waiting for a reply. When you don't get a reply, what can you do? MAKE A NEW ACCOUNT!!

That's embarrassing. But I'm not surprised it'd be some European putting this dumb idea into place. Really explains a lot. That's just tragically inept and incompetent. Nobody will ever figure that one out. That's why shadowbanning is so effective and nobody ever figures it out and just evades it because it's really obvious now that it's a known thing.

if they are going to make a new account anyway why not try to delay the process by making them think they are not banned?
your solution does not aid in stopping people from making new accounts

@for_cryingout_loud said in #15:
> "
>
> And then the witch hunts start or people instead of complaining about transparency will say that lichess mods are dumb
> and x is a cheater because all reporters believe they are right

How can you tell since it has never been put in place ... ?
And btw, I believe that transparency or not, mods will forever be dumb to reporters :)

@Erisian said in #10:
> Nice. A youtube link that doesn't work. You sure showed me, champ. And whatever they said, I'm sure it's totally smart. What can be smarter for a chess site than "let the cheaters stay and just hope nobody notices they are in a tiny pool of other cheaters". That's so smart and brilliant. Not like all those other sites and their silly "banning the cheating accounts and getting rid of them".
>
> Who in their right minds made a decision this patently absurd? Did some reddit mod get ahold of the site and thinks shadowbanning just works everywhere?

Moreover, shadowban is inmoral, indecent, opaque, unfair and I wonder why people here consider it to be legal when it deprives a user against its legit right to a defense and that is a human right granted by United Nations, as if the algorithm and people were flawless in their decisions, I thought that belief of being the superior race was over, that discussion took place long ago and we know all the result, why do we have this sh** here in lichess? and worst of all who tolerates this??? Later lichess claims transparency from other sites and demands accountability on procedures in feminist cases when here the founder is a pro-shadow banner, that is equivalent to what paramilitars were doing during cold war by entering the house of suspects at night, wearing a hood and making them dissappear forever without a trial or defense of any kind just because they were in the opposition. You are with me or against me, that is what shadow banning represents and that is what people who make it possible are like, they work in the shadows and send others to do the dirty job so as not to be held accountable..End to shadow bans, end to opacity in lichess, make things transparent oncee and for all, change that evil TOS, enough secret moves and decisions taken behind the curtain to eliminate whoever disagrees with a bunch of "volunteers" (not all volunters are like that) who think have a license to do that. Simply ilegal. If you want to ban me, do it with arguments at day light and I will strike back in my defense with arguments, do not stub me in the back cause that is what you are doing to users with this shadow ban End shadow ban full stop.